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Doulton Lambeth Vase

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Royal Doulton6 of 61Royal Doulton luncheon plates.  KNOW WHO MADE IT-NEED MORE INFO
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Posted 4 months ago

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senchi
(62 items)

Vintage vase/pitcher? Unfortunately broken on the top, glued, and chipped.
Doulton Lambeth stamped, with number and "M.S."
It is stamped on the bottom. Did a little research online, and to my understanding this could be from 1890s.
For the beginner it is very hard to understand all marks, stamps, numbers, etc..
Please share your knowledge and help me with the era.
Regards?

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Comments

  1. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    Helen A Arding is the HA monogram found here:
    http://www.antique-marks.com/doulton-artists-marks.html
  2. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    Mary Slater is the M. S. mark:
    http://www.antique-marks.com/doulton-artists-marks-s.html
  3. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    That mark would mean before 1891 and after 1873. The word England was used from then on.
    http://landmark.lambeth.gov.uk/display_page.asp?section=landmark&id=4357
  4. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    Helen Arding worked as a decorator at the Lambeth works from 1879 - 1884 specializing in flower painting.
  5. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    This would be a piece of Doulton Lambeth Faience Ware.

    Rare as hens' teeth!
    Well, maybe not THAT rare!
    Check out this vase also damaged.
    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ANTIQUE-DOULTON-LAMBETH-VASE-1870s-AESTHETIC-VICTORIAN-FAIENCE-ART-NOUVEAU-/291053176411
  6. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    Are there any impressed marks?
  7. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    I think Anne Landers may be able to help even more!
  8. senchi senchi, 4 months ago
    Vetraio50,
    Thank you so much for the info!! There are no impressed marks as far as I can see, but its 6am and I need to wake up :)
    Will check your links later. Hope Anne can look at it too :)
    Regards
  9. senchi senchi, 4 months ago
    Ok. There is something!! "D space LT" I can see. There are alao some numbers, or somerhing else but its unreadable..it is in the darker area and its very hard to even spot it. Had you not asked I would have never noticed.
    Have a Great Day!!
  10. icollectglass, 4 months ago
    I like this blog ...

    All about repaired antiques and collecting them ...

    http://andrewbaseman.com/blog/
  11. vetraio50 vetraio50, 4 months ago
    Past Imperfect is one of THE great sites.!
  12. senchi senchi, 3 months ago
    Wonder if this nail type of repair is expensive?
  13. vetraio50 vetraio50, 3 months ago
    Personally I would not do that type of restoration to this jug. Doulton collectors would not like it. It is an old type of restoration done by tinkers or gypsies in the good old days.
  14. AnneLanders AnneLanders, 3 months ago
    I will look at it tomorrow. I have my research on my other computer which I can't access from iPad....Faience style isn't that rare, they used this style since John Slater arrived I think 1869, what becomes rare are your artists.
    I wouldn't call it a vase as it appears to have a handle and a pouring spout. I could be wrong as the photos don't show it in full....it may have even had a lid. In my collection of Doulton being Slater we call this a ewer

    Restoration work on Stoneware is far more advised than on glass. And in a lot of cases a necessity to keep a Stoneware piece alive.

    By nature Stoneware is very dry. Place your fingers underneath and run them across the white part, you will feel how much dryer compared to a porcelain tea cup. Once you've broken it, the tendency is the paint will chip off around the outside of the crack. And because it's on the rim then really noticeable.

    If you can afford to have it repaired and it's a piece you want to keep and hand down then get it done. Google where you live to find a Stoneware specialist. Do not post it, drop it off as it might break further in the weakness.and ask the repairer to show you samples of him doing repairs...it should cost a lot of money. Have you got the pieces? The hardest thing will be matching the piece.

    Think you have dates and perhaps artists but no harm in checking. Keeps me fresh...lol. Not too sure if it is Mary Slater, whether she was there as yet in the times that Vetraio 50 has mentioned...it was made in London, not Stoke and could be part of the a Hyacinth looking(don't think now Primrose) this might be.....

    Did you say it had England on it? Any lions or crowns? I can't see them. I think it's possibly earlier than the other but let's look tomorrow...good night Anne
  15. AnneLanders AnneLanders, 3 months ago
    You may find the base glazed so you'll wonder why I said it's dry but where the break is, that crack will be bringing in air and causing more drying out...:)
  16. AnneLanders AnneLanders, 3 months ago
    And that meant to say it shouldn't cost a lot of repair money...sorry,mim tired..
  17. AnneLanders AnneLanders, 3 months ago
    Edit again , the hardest thing will be matching the paint...lol..I don't know if it's me or the over enthusiastic spell check that I seem to be fighting with...
  18. senchi senchi, 3 months ago
    Anne thank you for the info.
    Unfortunately I do not have pieces, but I was hopping that a stoneware specialist would be able to fix and match the paint color.
    There is no "England" written anywhere.
    THis is really confusing :)
    If the initials "M.S." are for Mary Slater, what are "A.H."? Is it for Helen A Arding. Possibly 2 artists?
    Thank you all for your help!
  19. AnneLanders AnneLanders, 3 months ago
    lol...it’s not confusing, it’s just part of the research process. …it’s hard to for a person 10000 miles away to help without the vase in my hand but I’ll try…and hopefully the following can be useful for other people who have pots or vases in Doulton to look for.

    It’s a water pitcher, it’s not a vase…handle=pitcher or ewer as Doulton call them.
    and yes any restorer can fix it I was just asking if you had them...

    Most vases/pots/pitchers had two artists working on them for two reasons. To save time and their fortes. You see how its painted brown underneath the Grecian type pattern around the rim, well most likely one artist will have done that and then the other the flower drawings, so they gave them both credit. In some potteries especially in transfer print where they would over paint the pattern, then one artist would be on one side and the other across the other side..if you imagine how many vases they pumped out they had to have some efficiencies on the stock vases...


    Very rarely would an artist reverse their initials...unless they were cross pollinating factories and didn’t want the other factories to know they were getting work elsewhere..no most artists would proudly state who they were...but you'd be surprised how many artists might paint on your vase..we all have images of them painstakingly sweating over our beautiful vase for 27 hours but in most cases an hour max...lol...

    So who are your artists? Yes Mary Slater is correct. I'm not too sure if she was related to the great John Slater their Art Director, I've never been able to find out. And yes, Helen Arding painted this, although her sister Mary developed the style from her work on beautiful roses and daisies, the latter being the true Faience style...and just stunning and she was definitely the better known of the two sisters. Helen moved to San Franciso and died in 1937. Her's Helens inspiration from her sister Mary....

    https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/19889/lot/72/

    https://www.bonhams.com/auctions/18933/lot/64/

    https://images1.bonhams.com/image?src=Images/live/2011-08/17/8270845-79-1.jpg&width=308&top=0.364500&left=0.000000&right=0.981700&bottom=1.000000&dt=image_tag&fill=auto



    ok so we're Lambeth factory in London, no England mark so it’s before 1891. I can’t see any reference here to Faience on your mark but I do know that some very expensive pottery re-sellers who state that it's a Faience Mark but I have my doubts. They seem to have copied their information from another source and it goes on....Why would they use this Mark if they had the Faience mark available at this time?...so not convinced sorry and why I don't use the internet for Mark matching. The best resources for Marks are the companies themselves or books that have Marks identified by real experts or there's another one I use in Stoke, it’s the Potteries Museum and I got their mark information when I visited and found it very accurate on my collection. But it happens and good meaning ppl love to help ppl looking. I saw that link that was posted and yes it had the same artist and the same Mark but Doulton at the same time had a Faience mark. So this is an example of what I’m saying, the eBay seller has looked up and called it that when it’s more likely not. And even that Lambeth site is incorrect because they are missing the Lambeth Faience stamp but called the plain one Faience…all because they’ve used the same source that in my opinion is wrong. I’m sorry to labor the point but this is one of my pet hates in research, he copy and paste method. I always believe it must go back to the source…

    Questions please. On the base is there any mention of Doulton embedded in the pot, not stamped but pressed. And does it say Doulton, Doulton’s, Slater patent anything? If you can’t see it, feel for it by rubbing your finger. This just helps more with the year..I can’t see it on yours because of the glare but doesn’t mean it’s not there. And it doesn’t matter if its not
  20. senchi senchi, 3 months ago
    Anne, you ARE an expert!! :)
    It is hard to see other markings on the botton, but hardly can see "D space LT"
    Can't see the crown or anything else :(
    One area of the bottom is little darker with some brownish color, so I coyld only close examine the lighter colored area..where I found letters DLT.
    Thanks for all your help!!
  21. AnneLanders AnneLanders, 3 months ago
    No expert, just a keen interest in some other style of vases produced by Doulton in the same factory...

    So the best I can do is 1877-1884 without knowing if it says Doulton or Doulton's from your DLT. These Marks fade in time especially when it's on the base and sitting sometimes in water...hope you get it repaired and if you do please show us the photos...Thanks Vetraio50 for your great contribution too ...Anne xx
  22. senchi senchi, 3 months ago
    Thank you very much!
    What difference would it make as far as age if Doulton or 's?
  23. AnneLanders AnneLanders, 3 months ago
    Not much and nothing to the value really, some ppl collect things based on various striking a of the way the marks are or how Doulton were named... I still call it Doulton, mainly because my collection was a Doulton's and my family called them that...it's only a royal warrant..

    And in relation to collecting...they made less ewers than vases so they are rarer but ppl collect vases more if that makes sense, so ppl seek vases more than ewers thanks again Anne

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