Posted 2 years ago
Tobygb
(1 item)
This Mason Cross buckle is very old, I am looking for the clasp that it would hook to on the other end of the belt, any help would be appriciated!
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Hmmm, The name on the back is a relative and my GG Grandfather was a 33 degree making me think it was Masonic, good point! Thanks for the info.
Are you sure there was a clasp? It could just hook into the belt holes.
Hello all-happy to meet you- I have the same buckle, but in "German" silver with a wider tongue for the keeper-officers? I'm pretty sure mine is USArmy Medical Corps, 1902-yours might be a tad earlier from the look of the casting and the tongue-you need a Civil War period keeper to match the belt side of the plate(if you want to wear it-I would!)..not too hard to find, but try them out, all different dimensions and tongue width--contractors were given very loose (by today's standards) parameters. Been looking for a dupe of mine, yours the first one I've seen..these may have been private purchase, not issue, but I dunno.....fun trying to track it all down....Hope to hear from some of you guys, I'm researching some of my plates, deciding what to do, etc.....yours, Philip Bowditch
Agree fraternal not military related.
scott
Hey guys....Hayes Otoupalik.com has in Span.Am #001323 a pair of the brass Med.Corps 1902 collar tabs-I have one, in silver, that came with my plate. I don't think the Maltese cross lasted too long, by WWI all Med seemed to go to the familiar cadesus. Some of this stuff can be tough to track down...long live the internet!! Philip
Yep-- I am familiar with the collar insignia you are talking about, but I have never documented use of the buckle by military medical personnel.
I have NEVER seen a period image of a medical guy wearing this buckle.
I have seen images of fraternal use of this buckle and I have seen period catalogues where the buckle is IDd as fraternal (the same companies that made military items manufactured fraternal uniforms, swords and equipment).
scott
Maltese Cross
"Symbol of Honor, Courage, and Dedication"
The eight-point Maltese Cross is the international symbol of the fire service's willingness to make great sacrifices in order to protect others from the ravages of fire. It is a badge of courage and honor and it's story is a hundred years old.
This honored symbol originated with a group of eleventh century knights who were serving in a Jerusalem hospital. They became known as the Order of Knights Hospitaller and later became the Knights of St. John. This charitable organization cared for the ill with great compasion.
Later they assisted the Knights of Crusaders in thier effort to win back the Holy Land. As the Knights of St. John and Knights of Crusaders attacked the city walls, the Saracens first threw glass bombs containing highly flammable liquids and then flaming torches. Many knights were severly burned, some suffering agonizing deaths. Risking horrible death, those knights who were able struggled desperatly to help thier burning comrades, beating out the flames and dragging them to safety. In acknowledgment of thier heroic deeds of rescuing fellow knights and fighting fires, the cross which they wore was decorated and inscribed.
In 1530, the Island of Malta was given to the courageous knights. The symbol on thier flag, the eight-point cross, became known as the "Maltese Cross." The cross, which had originally helped the knights distinguish between friend and foe, became the ultimate symbol of heroism and service. The cross, which is considered sacred, represents the principles of charity, loyalty, chivalry, gallantry, generosity to friend and foe, protection of the weak and dexterity in service.
Today, firefighters wear the Maltese Cross to symbolize thier willingness to risk thier lives to save others.
Wow...site dormant for 2 years, now a firestorm of debate...!! great...I would love to see some positive id of fraternal...I don't care, really, would just like to positively id what the dang hell this plate is...good plate to wear, not so valuable you don't dare touch it (CSA etc) but very cool looking--the first time I showed it to a VERY advanced CW collector, he took one look and said," don't get all excited thinking it's a CW Med plate, there weren't any, it's Med about 1900"....does anyone know anything about very high quality Austrian plates about 1860(guessing the Seven Weeks War-Austro-Prussian War--?)--having a hard time even on the internet .....hope to hear from you guys....it's fun......Philip
The mistaken ID to army medical is understandable due to similar collar insignia.
It reminds me of fraternal frock coats with a cross on each cuff and gloves with similar crosses. I used to see them regularly IDd as Civil War chaplains uniforms. Over the years word has gotten out that they were fraternal. At the FEB Civil War show in Dalton, GA; I saw a reenactor wearing a fraternal coat with the cross cuffs-- he was supposed to be a Civil War chaplain!
Military/ fraternal dealer catalogues of the era will confirm-- try looking for a Horstmann, Lilley or similar Co. catalogue. There are probably some online.
Good luck.
scott
Hey, Scott- you might be right-I have a '27 Bannerman around somewhere, I remember seeing stuff like this in it-while I'm at it: I have a nice GAR plate, gilt is still good, but this one has two stars (part of the casting), one on each side of the down star point. Significance? All the ones I've seen have G-A-R between the upper points, but are plain below. I'll post some pics soon of some other stuff-we'll play Stump the Stars!...thanks, Philip
Post the GAR plate-- I'd like to see it.
I deal in Civil War items (among a lot of other things)!
scott
There have been some good comments on this buckle, what I need is to find where I can find a maker for the clasp that attaches the hook to belt, it slides on the lesther and recieves the hook on the buckle? Your thoughts please.