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Loetz Olympia, PN II-2829, enameled

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Posted 1 year ago

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bohemiangl…
(305 items)

I acquired this piece in a multi-item trade some months ago. I assumed at the time that it was either Heckert or Moser, although the export stamp on the bottom (Made in Czecho-Slovakia) inside a circle is one that I've only ever seen on suspected Kralik pieces. It's very small - about 92mm, and glows under black light, like Loetz Olympia. Once again, the Loetz Series II book provides the answer. Loetz Olympia Glatt, Prod. Nr. II-2829, made for Max Emmanuel, London, (commission number 346/853, which is outside the range of patterns published in Ricke II).

Comments

  1. Greatsnowyowl Greatsnowyowl, 1 year ago
    cool.. but it still could be Heckert decoration. Heckert did buy blanks from Loetz. I've been meaning to put a day aside to go looking for Heckert shapes in the Loetz book. the records of people who bought certain shapes isn't complete from what I understand. Most of the Heckert buy isn't noted other than that they bought regularly.
  2. Greatsnowyowl Greatsnowyowl, 1 year ago
    what's really interesting is the czech mark on a 1905 blank and a decoration that was known from an earlier period. all of the examples I've seen of this islamic type design is 1890- early 1900's.. not later.

    I guess they kept making it.. or they were still selling old stock and had to mark for export orrrr????

  3. bohemianglassandmore bohemianglassandmore, 1 year ago
    But Heckert wasn't a Czech firm, and this piece has a Czech export stamp. The book does list this as a Max Emmanuel commission.
  4. Greatsnowyowl Greatsnowyowl, 1 year ago
    but it lists it as a ME sale of 1905 that's still a problem with the export label since czecho slovakia didn't exist for another 14 years...

    From what I understand the buyers of certain shapes are listed when she finds the receipts for them. But not all receipts are in existence. So because a buyer is mentioned doesn't mean it's an absolute that that shape was sold ONLY to that company unless it's called out as a commission and this one isn't. (as far as I understand how the notations work anyway, I could be wrong of course :) )

    on Fritz Heckert and country.. I am sure you're right. I always get confused with who was in what country, in what year.. I need diagrams to keep it all straight :) My geography is shite and they kept changing the borders! Not fair!! In my mind I lump it all together as same general region but of course, it's not as simple as I make it in my mind.

    I still think this piece is a puzzle.. a 1905 shape. With an early 1900's type decor with a czech export stamp placing it in time a good 14 years later..
  5. bohemianglassandmore bohemianglassandmore, 1 year ago
    The date for the shape is no big deal... I have that cobalt papillon serving set in a 1908 shape with the square mark, which was used in the 1930s.
  6. Alfredo Alfredo, 1 year ago
    I bet the blank is Loetz, but the decor was applied by someone else--I go with Heckert.
  7. bohemianglassandmore bohemianglassandmore, 1 year ago
    I think it's highly likely that it was decorated elsewhere - the question is, was it decorated before or after the export stamp was applied?
  8. Greatsnowyowl Greatsnowyowl, 1 year ago
    to me that smacks of old stock....they did make some designs continuously but to me this piece looks like it would have been dated looking by the time marking was required
  9. LoetzBuddies LoetzBuddies, 1 year ago
    There are two Heckert "arab" vases on Ebay. They have the same Arabic writing as this piece. One is actually marked FH arab. I've been tempted to buy one.
  10. LoetzBuddies LoetzBuddies, 1 year ago
    Sorry.....not Ebay. They are on RL.
  11. Greatsnowyowl Greatsnowyowl, 1 year ago
    I've been watching them. If I had more money I'd be all over that signed one. the other is still out of my range but I think they're well priced.
  12. bohemianglassandmore bohemianglassandmore, 1 year ago
    The enameling on my little piece is not nearly the quality as the Fritz Heckert or Moser Islamic pieces. The problem for all the decorator theories put forth so far is the Made in Czecho-Slovakia stamp, which dates this piece to between 1918 and 1939. Heckert was folded into Josephinenhuette in 1923 (leaving a five year window), and besides, I can't believe any piece would ever leave the Heckert refinery with a Made In Czecho-Slovakia stamp. The Heckert and Moser pieces are dated much earlier, as Alisa points out - 1900 or earlier. This piece may be intended to look like them, but I think this was decorated in Czechoslovakia -possibly by the only firm that has produced pieces with this stamp that I could positively identify - Kralik. I readily admit that in the end, I just don't know.
  13. Greatsnowyowl Greatsnowyowl, 1 year ago
    Brian has said that Harrach Decorated Fritz Heckert pieces at times as well as providing the blanks, there are even examples that show the Fritz Heckert signature as part of the package Harrach provided.

    So what we can gather from that is that it might not have been exclusive to Harrach. Heckert might have farmed it out to other companies as well. I know I've seen Vastly different qualities of enamel from Heckert.

    I've also seen evidence that even after Heckert was pulled into JH that similar product was produced from JH. I don't know what country JH was in during that period. right now they are in poland and are about 2 or 3 miles from the harrach factory which is still in CZ.

    I've seen almost no evidence that Kralik ever did refining beyond hot working at their shops. Myers neffe did. I know Jitka has a tendency to lump all families of the kralik tree into the Kralik umbrella including Meyers neffe. I called her out on it because she said Kralik was even better and more accomplished then Harrach.. It turned out she was meaning Meyers Neffe, but they ARE Kralik to her. (so that makes me wonder what exactly is meant by the kralik and Loetz shared commission thing.. did she mean kralik.. did she mean meyers neffe.. did she mean both? cause we did know already that Meyers neffe and loetz shared commissions (lobmeyer is what I am thinking of)

    I think Annin was the Loetz owned refiners. that's a guess.. I know Annin was loetz owned and they were producing glass into the 20's and almost everything I saw as annin was decorated...

    Annin's product was very very similar to Harrach. Deb T. asked Jitka how we could tell it (in hte particular instance it was a cut back and gilded beidermeier type vase, the type of thing you often see with portraits of young women) Jitka said there was no way to tell.

    Anyway, yeah I can see how the decoration on this isn't up to the highest standards of quality but I do have some signed heckert (and moser) that displayed a similar doesn't quite pass the sniff test up close.. but from a distance it looks fine..

    So I wouldn't rule out something that smells like heckert just because it smells a little off when you get too close.

    I do think the possibility of old stock is very real for this time period. Everyone was struggling and looking to save money in the post war period.

    What I am getting at...Maybe they (Loetz annin) were able to sell off some overs that had been in a barn for years to America that they had decorated for Fritz heckert years before... (England didn't require a made in mark at that point in time.)

    I really didn't have the impression that olympia was being produced into the 20's.. has anyone ever seen a signed Loetz Olympia other than this one?
  14. Greatsnowyowl Greatsnowyowl, 1 year ago
    or maybe Annin did some decoration in the style of the islamic.. Why not? they were keeping up with the styles from what I could see. it still would have been old stock I think but who knows.

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